Are you convinced yet about the dangers of soy? Many aren’t. “Is soy bad for you? …Really?” I hear the question so often I want to scream.
After decades of hearing marketing spin about how soy is a wonder food, a protein-rich legume able to rescue us from our dependence on meat, I suppose it’s understandable why so many people have yet to understand fully the dangers of soy. Really, you’re not going to get the full story unless you research it on your own. And why would you, when soy is “universally” touted as a health food?
Well, it isn’t.
Dangers of Soy
Thankfully, more and more independent research has been done regarding the dangers of soy, and what it’s revealed should scare you.
Phytoestrogens
Soy is higher in phytoestrogens than just about any other food source. Phytoestrogens are plant-based estrogens that mimic estrogen in our bodies. In recent years, you may have read about studies which indicate phytoestrogens are good for you. But ask yourself, who funded those studies? The soy industry, that’s who. Independent research has clearly shown that consuming phytoestrogens is downright dangerous for the human body.
It’s only common sense. No one argues, for example, that a leading cause of breast cancer, endometriosis, uterine fibroids, infertility, and low libido is unopposed estrogen, or estrogen dominance. Why, then, would anyone argue that we should consume more of a food high in estrogen?
An infant taking the recommended amount of soy formula is consuming a hormone load equivalent of 4 birth control pills a day! Is it any wonder we’ve seen such a dramatic rise in precocious puberty with young girls starting their periods at 6 and 7?
Goitrogenic
Soy will destroy your thyroid. Many foods are goitrogenic (thyroid suppressing), but soy is king of them all. Goitrogens work by preventing your thyroid from getting the necessary amount of iodine. Friends, I believe this is what happened to Oprah’s thyroid. She pushed soy for years, featured it in everyone one of her “healthy” diets, and it destroyed her thyroid. If your thyroid fails, what happens? You gain weight. You have a harder time regulating your moods. You get colder more easily. You’re more easily fatigued. You demonstrate an inability to concentrate and remember details. The list goes on. You simply don’t want to mess with your thyroid.
Phytates
Phytates are enzyme-inhibitors that block mineral absorption in human digestive tract. They are naturally present in all grains, seeds, nuts, and legumes (which is why everyone should read this primer on how to eat grains, if you eat them at all.) But soy is so high in phytates that it’s almost impossible to get rid of them. Simply soaking soy overnight in an acidic medium won’t do the trick. Soy must be fermented in order to be digestible to humans. That means that if you eat soy at all, you should stick to fermented soy products like miso, tempeh, natto, or a naturally fermented soy sauce (tamari).
Trypsin inhibitors
Finally soy is rich in trypsin inhibitors. Trypsin is a digestive enzyme we need to properly digest protein. Without enough trypsin, you’ll experience many digestive problems including stomach cramps, diarrhea, and bleeding. You’ll also be leaving yourself open to future problems with your pancreas.
Debunking The Asian Soy Myth
But, people say, what about Asians? They eat soy every day, and they’re so healthy!
In this article by Nina Planck, she writes:
Soy farming started around 1100 BC in China, where it was used to build soil fertility and feed animals. Soy beans were not considered fit for humans until the Chinese learned to ferment them, which makes them digestible. Asian diets now include fermented soy beans in the form of natto, miso, tamari, and tempeh.
Soy producers want you to eat more soy — more than the Asians eat, and more than is good for you. The Japanese and Chinese eat 10 grams of soy per day — about two teaspoons. Yet a soy manufacturer recommends Americans eat ten times what the Japanese eat — 100 grams of soy protein per day. In The Soy Zone, Barry Sears recommends a daily diet of a minimum of 50 grams of soy, and up to 75 grams for women and 100 grams for men.
It’s like red wine: a glass or two a day may be good for you; a bottle or two every day rots your liver.
Did you catch that? Asians only eat 2 teaspoons of soy a day, usually as a condiment, and it’s highly fermented! Fermentation takes care of many of the dangers of soy. Plus, the typical Asian will also consume soy with mineral-rich and nutrient-dense foods such as fish broth (naturally high in iodine & other minerals which support the thyroid).
So, Is Soy Bad For You?
The short answer? YES! Let’s be clear on the recent history of soy. The soybean was a modest and unpopular crop until food manufacturers intent on creating cheap vegetable oils convinced the U.S. government to start subsidizing it. The soy was turned into oil, and the industry was left with an industrial waste product. Then somebody had a brilliant idea:
Let’s take this industrial waste product full of toxins and carcinogens — isolated soy protein — and turn it into food that people will eat!
Soy foods were born. From Nina Planck’s article:
The FDA refused to approve isolated soy protein as a safe food additive with the designation “Generally Recognized as Safe.”
Agribusiness giant Archer Daniels Midland withdrew its application for the coveted GRAS status for soy protein, after an outcry from scientists about the toxins and carcinogens that come with it. They can still put soy protein in your food, but they have to get pre-market approval for every product.
Isolated soy protein is no health food. But we don’t eat soy protein with a spoon. How do we eat it? It is the main ingredient in soy burgers, ice cream, milk shakes, and fake cheese. These soy protein products are phony foods — but they must look like the real foods they imitate. So the soy industry transforms a small yellow soy bean into something resembling a hamburger. They make soy “milk” and “ice cream” white and creamy.
The other ingredients in these foods are no better for you than the soy protein that goes into them. Soy milk, for example, is simply a cocktail of soy protein, sugar, and vegetable oil. The “natural” MSG formed in soy processing is already bad for you, but even more MSG, and more flavorings, are added. Imitation foods need a lot of help to be tasty. Many savory soy foods are loaded with additives to give them the flavor of the real foods they mimic. Most imitation meat, for example, contains man-made MSG, which causes migraines and is associated with brain cancer.
Soy foods aren’t real food. They aren’t traditional. They aren’t old. They’re industrial waste products dressed up in pretty clothes and marketed to an ignorant public.
What Do I Recommend As Alternatives To Soy Milk?
If you can’t do dairy and are looking for healthier alternatives than soy milk, please see Healthy Milk Substitutes With Recipes for a couple of excellent alternatives you can make at home.
One alternative I particularly enjoy is coconut milk. It’s full of the best kinds of saturated fat — medium chain triglycerides — which help speed your metabolism. It’s also exquisitely flavorful and perfect stirred into curries, soups, and sauces. Sadly, almost all coconut milk available at your grocery store comes in BPA-lined cans. To my knowledge, only Native Forest brand is BPA-free, and not all stores carry it. Click here to find coconut milk sold in BPA-free packaging online.
ETA: Reader comments below prompted me to include a couple of additions to this post. The questions: What about tofu or homemade soy milk? Their consumption is quite widespread in Asian cultures, and they’re non-fermented soy foods. Are they okay? The answers: Tofu originated around the 2nd century BC in China, and it was made from fermented bean curd. That is how it was traditionally made before the days of refrigeration. Most modern tofu isn’t fermented anymore. You can still buy varieties of fermented tofu (aka “Stinky Tofu” or “Pickled Tofu”) in some Asian markets, though. Also, according to the most comprehensive online account of soymilk’s history, its use was rare before the 20th century and widespread usage was highly unlikely. In other words, it’s not a traditional food. Nor is non-fermented tofu. They’re the Asian equivalents of margarine, hot bath canning, “vegetable oil,” or soda pop — something relatively new on the food scene which became very widespread with the industrialization of the food supply. And like these industrialized food products, they are bad for your health.
288 references to the toxicity of soy in the FDA’s poisonous plants database
77 studies showing the adverse reactions to dietary soy
174 studies showing the adverse reactions to isoflavones (phytoestrogens)
(photo by unite)
Liked what you read? You may find these posts interesting:
This is why I’m cutting back. RT: @FoodRenegade Not convinced yet about the dangers of soy? Read this http://su.pr/2BpRoa
This comment was originally posted on Twitter
I suggest basing your judgement on Soy around an article that is at least referenced… who would gamble their health on a random blog post?
This would be a good start: http://www.vegansociety.com/lifestyle/nutrition/
(there are hundreds of conflicting scientic reports on the consequences of soy for health – this information has reviewed and continues to review all reports and bases it’s recommendations on a balance of those reports rather than 1 or 2 that is in line with a given agenda)
Educate yourselves properly – spurious blog posts like this can have detrimental impacts on people’s lifestyles.
Oaks – thank you so much for your comment. I’ve left a couple of posts along those lines in other areas on this website asking for better research and using qualified resources. So much of what I’ve seen here is inaccurate and some of these posts indicate people believe it anyway. It’s irresponsible.
The problem with “qualified resources” is that they are generally funded by big pharmaceutical companies, who’se sole agenda is profit.
One of the greatest marketing techniques is the “Law of Authority”. How many times have you seen an actor dressed in a white coat and stethoscope, “advising” on the health benefits of a drink or drug?
Do your own research, apply common sense and above all, Ignore the media!
When you have people like Michael Taylor, a former lobbyist for Monsanto – the largest producer of genetically altered soy beans – sitting high and mighty in the FDA, how are people supposed to get the truth. Soy isnt just a health danger, its socially irresponsible.
This article may be a random blog post, but it is certainly referenced! In the post I provided a link to independent research done about soy. That link takes you to a page that collects much of the independent research in one listing.
References on that page include:
288 references to the toxicity of soy in the FDA’s poisonous plants database
77 studies showing the adverse reactions to dietary soy
and
174 studies showing the adverse reactions to isoflavones (phytoestrogens)
The “independent research” you cite comes from a website where they tout “plenty of eggs, cream, cheese and meat” as a healthy diet! The research includes studies about how pigs, cows and rats react to soy. This is a joke!
Yes, for all the most unbiased information on soy and other non-animal “protein” sources, we should all visit a vegan website. lmao
A few of my friends are vegan, and they all eat soy (much to my chagrin). Refrain from being immature, please.
I was going to say the same thing. Yes, slam the “random blogpost” and then direct people to your vegan website, where they are too lazy to research a, what could be considered, “caveman” diet, before humans had the ability or foresight to kill for survival.
Humans have a hard time digesting wheat as well. Processed miracle food that humans discovered could feed a growing population quickly.
We shouldn’t even be consuming lactose past infancy.
What I can’t stand about the Americans of today is… we will bend BACKWARDS to say things like, “Milk can’t be bad for you because why else would they sell it?” “Soy can’t be bad for you because they sell it”. Well with that logic I’m sure you agree cigarettes are okay because…they sell them! DO YOU’RE RESEARCH PEOPLE. Who works for pharmaceutical companies? DOCTORS DO. You know that that means? They will prescribe you ACUTANE (known to make teens real angry and even KILL THEM) over something simple like… going dairy free for 6 months. Oh yeah that’s right dairy causes acne! But oh wait… how long has it been known to cause acne? I can reference one source from the 80′s! An how many people really know about this? Not to many. The government just want’s $$$ or something along those lines. Dig deep inside yourself and realize just because our forefathers consumed this trash, doesn’t mean you don’t have to continue the tradition. Save yourself from acne, cancer, hormone problems, etc. and EDUCATE YOURSELF ON WHAT FOUNDED THIS COUNTRY. The so called companies we trust in? Just want our money. Whether it kills us or not.
A very straight forward and informative post.
I’ve known soy was bad, but I wasn’t quite sure why, and I hadn’t looked at it like you stated in the last bit
“Soy foods aren’t real food. They aren’t traditional. They aren’t old. They’re industrial waste products dressed up in pretty clothes and marketed to an ignorant public.”
Thanks very much.
.-= Q´s last blog ..An easy change for the sake of the environment… =-.
So will it be better to continue to suck out the backs of farmed sick scared murdered animals… What is really bad for you.. Maybe if more people demanded the look into natural foods rather than eating living animals we will find the majic of life.. I will eat the soy anyday over the sick animal that was raised on soy….
Cantsen — I don’t eat animals raised on soy either. Rather, I opt out of the industrialized food system altogether. That means I say no to soy, and that I say yes to grass-fed/pastured/wild animals.
Just out of curiosity, what then is your opinion on the birth control pill?
Caveman diet… eat to survive. Everything should be natural as it was prior to industrialization. Look into food forests and the benefits of raising and keeping chickens on your property.
well said!
I’m sorry, but just because you are a vegetarian doesn’t mean that the world should be vegetarian. Human beings were never built to be vegetarians and it’s clear by our general makeup and our jaw structure, teeth, etc. There are only a very minute population of indigenous groups on earth that even come close to being vegetarian and the only reason they are is because of the scarcity of meat in their region. Food is regional and is eaten according to availability. Natural is the way to go, however I really don’t have time these days to go hunting to spear my game or fish for my fish.
You are right, many farm animals are raised on soy and that makes them sick as well. But ingesting it directly is no better. The only thing we can do is limit what we can control directly. Unfortunately, I can’t control what mass produced animals are fed, but I can control my own feed. Unfortunately if I cut animal products from my diet I would not be able to maintain the muscularity that I have. There simply would not be enough protein in my diet. Bottom Line.
bangkok trainer:
do some legitimate research before raging on, because you have a personal need to believe we are natural born meat eaters. There is tons of good research out there to refute that and America is sick getting sicker so it’s not even reasonable and void of common sense to make your comment.
The issue isn’t soy. I avoid soy as well. We are complex carbohydrate starch eaters and plant eaters.
Soy is some of the main ingredient in fake meat products and any thinking person can reason that can’t be good. If people would get over their obsession with flesh and start eating complex carbs they would be healthy and we wouldn’t need to debate soy vs meat in the first place.
Your muscles? are you serious? There are issues around enjoying looking at your own flesh as well but I will not go into it.
If you ever choose to be healthy (healthy-not vain) a place to start would be The China Study (and no it has nothing to do with soy).
Go to Dr. Mcdougalls website. Another healthy place to begin.
And anyone who uses the phrase “bottom line” should consider that a red flag to examine their heart, motives, and more importantly their knowledge. I wouldn’t recommend asking other muscle heads.
amy
Wow. U should probaly do some more research before trying to inform people about the jaw structure of the human body. If researched, u would find our carnivores have no flat molars for grinding ( or plant chewing), & our stomach acid is 20 times weaker than the average carnivore. As far as ” only a minute population of indigenous groups that even come close to being vegetarian”, I grew up in a farm community & stopped eating meat when I was 10yrs old because it made me feel sick. I’ve been vegetarian for almost 20 yrs (almost 30 yrs old now). I think u should try readng EAT RIGHT FOR YOUR TYPE; which is about eating right for your blood type. I am B- which is fairly rare & therefore what my body needs is going to be different from someone who has O BLOOD TYPE & NEEDS MORE IRON LEADING THEM TO CRAVE RED MEAT. Every human is different, like you said, “it doesn’t mean that the world should be vegetarian” & furthermore nor should the world be carnivorous! To each his own, we live in a quickly evolving society & people who choose alternative lifestyles for whatever reason should be respected as well as people who live more tradtiionally. THERE ARE PLENTY OF ALTERNATIVES TO SOY- FOR EXAMPLE, MOST DON’T REALIZE 1 OZ OF WHEATGRASS CONTAINS 6.4 GRAMS OF PROTEIN & SPINACH & BROCCOLI ARE UP THERE AS WELL. The only bottom line is our health! Not your point of view! Stay healthy people!
Well said. I am not a vegan but not w/o consuming meat either. I think it has to be balance most of all. I respect individuals who chose eat a healthy for their type. I am AB+ It would be better for me to eat mainly fish oppose to eating beef and chicken. Knowledge is power!!!!
Your Blood type comments are beyond ignorant. This old saw has been dismantled years ago ~ but advocating for vegetable proteins is beyond the pale.
Hmmmmm…. do you think that at some point in your santimonious life that you, or at least one of your ancestors may have eaten an animal product (and here I cannot resist saying that I have never eaten a LIVE animal as you wrote in your post)? The plain fact is that modern man got here by eating meat and what other meager ingredients that he was able to raise for himself and his family. The rest of the world suffered from famine because modern farming methods that can produce surplus’ crops to send to those starving countries did not come along until the industrial revolution when modern implements made it possible to clear large areas of land, till and cultivate the soil, and harvest the resulting crops… I’m willing to bet, even now, that any one of the hungry of this world will not turn down a meal made up entirely of dead animals… so get over yourself.
While I’m talking about corporate farm methods, may I mention all of the untested chemicals that caused ill effects from paper-thin eagle’s eggs (result of DDT contamination) to birth defects and cancers in humans that were rampantly used – and are even now only being found as dangerous when we can get past the lobbiest’s influence on our law makers and regulators… such as the FDA… if you want an example of gross malfeasance look at how aspartame was refused safe status for over 8 years and suddenly and suspiciously was granted approval by a new FDA head that summarily negated all objections and approved it’s use, and then resigned and went to work for Searle… the company that developed it… at a very high salary… and when the government finally appointed people to investigate the case, the two prosecutors found that there was insufficient evidence to come to an investigative conclusion. But then guess what? Those same two prosecutors resigned their government jobs. Their new employer… Searle.
However, that is sustenance with which to feed another blogpost. I have gotten off of the original reason I replied to your post, to wit: Get off of your self-elevated, golden soap box, get your nose out of the sky (it may rain and drowning is a distinct possibility with it poked that high up) and try to contain your supercilious air that is so common to those of your pompous ilk. I get tired of being low-rated because I enjoy a fine medium rare steak, grilled to perfection, over almost any other food out there. I also enjoy vegetables too… nothing goes better with that steak than a good ‘ol baked potato.
If you choose the vegan life style, good, that is certainly your prerogative; but don’t look down on others that don’t subscribe to the same misguided logic that you do.
Wow, AGAIN. Why are you people so angry at vegetarians, is it jealousy? Perhaps? Eat meat if you want, there is no threat posed by vegetarians. We are not going to suddenly take the meat supply away. MISGUIDED INFORMATION!?! I CHOSE TO BECOME VEGETARIAN WHEN I WAS 10 YRS OLD, ON MY OWN, AGAINST MY PARENTS WILL, WITH NO INFORMATION BECASUE I KNEW IT “FELT RIGHT”. HAVE NOW BEEN VEGETARIAN FOR 20 YRS W NO PROBLEMS. I AM NOT MISGUIDED, BUT I WOULD SAY VERY GUIDED W/IN MYSELF, VERY IN-TUNE W MYSELF FROM A VERY EARLY AGE. YOU CAN ONLY WORRY AND TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF, SO STOP HARRASSING THE VEGETARIANS BECAUSES YOU CAN’T GRASP THE IDEA OF NOT EATING MEAT. SHUT UP AND EAT YOU RMEAT QUIETLY. IF YOU ARE LOW-RATED, IT IS MOST DEFINATELY BECASUE OF WHO YOU ARE, NOT BECASUE YOU EAT MEAT!
-PIXIE
Humans aren’t made to digest plants. We use it mainly to clear out our digestive system. Read the book “The Vegetarian Myth”. Its written by a long time vegetarian who had many problems with it.
That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard… “not made to digest plants”??? We are clearly omnivorous and such an extreme statement should raise a red flag in any rational person.
The recommendation about “The Vegetarian Myth” is well taken and the idea is that we humans are clearly meat eaters and to not do so has profound consequences.
Pixie, that is exactly my story! And I consider my decision to be one of the only ones I have always been sure of. I’m really confused by the way everyone is arguing about whether being vegan/vegetarian is natural or healthy. Isn’t the question whether soy is harmful or not? Personally the research on soy is terrifying but not necessarily because of the tofu I eat, most baby formula is soy based and many many many packaged foods are contaminated with soy as well, start checking it will amaze you. However as a vegan and not the type to spend more than 15 hour a week in the kitchen I find it difficult to find protein sources that will suffice. I have been working to eliminate soy but it is something I crave and it makes me feel good so it is hard. I guess this feeling is probably similar to the feeling a true meat lover gets when doc says to eliminate the steaks….. hard. I wish we could all see this as a problem for us all to deal with instead of jumping to opposite sides of the court immediately. I am a vegan because I believe it is the right thing to do, I encourage everyone to do the things they see as right as I will continue to do. Lets see what we can come up with.
fantastic article: the dangers of soy! http://bit.ly/IjV3j
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Did u know the avg baby fed soy formula is eating the amt of estrogen found in 4 birth control pills? http://su.pr/2BpRoa (via @FoodRenegade
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Did you know that the avg baby fed on sick fat scared cow milk is eating way more of eveything than that of soy. We raise our human children off the milk of a cow.. Whats wrong with that picture!!
Why not raise your baby on human milk instead?
That’s why there’s raw milk made from Jersey cows. Happy cows make healthy milk. Or even goat’s milk, which honestly, is even better. Pasteurized milk is what’s really bad, for anyone! But it seems most people don’t know the difference between pasteurized whole milk that anyone can get at a regular grocery store, and actual raw milk that’s ‘straight from the cow’.
Soy is bad, pasteurized cow’s milk is bad. Both are not good for people. Drink raw goat’s milk (which taste just like cow’s) or raw cow’s milk, if one were to drink milk at all.
Hmmm.. I disagree. Goat milk does not taste ANYTHING like cows milk.
I have to interject here. FRESH goats milk tastes very similar to FRESH cow’s milk. That canned stuff in the store just tastes sour!
We are the only mammal that drinks milk after we are weaned. Any one think that maybe we shouldn’t be drinking milk at all, expect for when babies are breast fed? And if you’re worried about the hormones in soy, you should be worried about hormones in milk. There are a ton of hormones pumped into cow’s food, which in turn are passed on to us. I don’t think we as a society eat enough soy to attribute early puberty to phytoestrogens – hormones are pumped into our food at every turn. Look for grain-fed meat (if you eat meat)and find out where it came from – you can’t always trust the label, beans, lots of fruits and vegetables.
Hi Lynda,
The milk I drink doesn’t contain hormones. It comes from cows eating lush, green grasses, and it is raw. I also wouldn’t touch grain-feed meat with a ten foot pole. This site advocates opting out of industrial agriculture, including industrial animal farming practices.
And yes, the average American *does* eat enough soy. It’s in just about every food in the supermarket — like corn. It’s even in our infant formulas.
Assuming we all buy processed food. I don’t. I buy everything as natural as I can find it. And the milk you drink may not contain hormones – more people should buy the mil you do. Butt he milk the vast majority of people drink does contain hormones. Once again, if you have a balanced diet, you don’t need to eliminate natural foods. Buy organic soy products, consume them in moderation and you will be just fine.
Are you going to tell me I can’t eat corn now? Corn is not in everything, high fructose corn syrup is in everything. There is a massive difference between the two. High fructose corn syrup is bad for you. Corn, as a whole food, is not.
I have a wonderful bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
I feed my babies Muscle Milk =P …My Baby = My Arms…haha
.-= Bangkok Trainer´s last blog post …Super Size Me Part I =-.
It’s been done for centuries and humans have been fine. We’ve done it much longer than human use of soy and soy products. What’s wrong with that picture?
The only problem with animal products is that we’re feeding them soy products and hormones…What do you think they’re putting in the already screwed up soy that wasn’t meant for ingestion in the first place?
.-= Bangkok Trainer´s last blog post …Super Size Me Part I =-.
and how much of that soy is Genetics?
interesting read
i have to ask though, and forgive my ignorance, but what about tofu? that’s made from soy right? and asians eat that, and i’m not aware of them getting health problems from it
Dan you are on the right track!! Still research everything but nothing has more danger than eating living flesh!! We are humans with sence to not eat like animals. Look are they saying its better to eat the animal that was raised on soy foods.
Cantsen — I addressed the tofu question in the post, and I also replied to Dan further down in the comments thread. Also, please know that I do NOT recommend feeding soy to animals either. If someone wants to eat animal foods, they need to be animal foods not raised in the industrial agriculture system. Find grass-fed/pastured/wild meats from local farmers; stick to raw or fermented dairy from grass-fed cows; etc. In other words, the mode of eating I recommend is based on sticking to Real Foods — foods that are old and traditional.
Well..eating living flesh is one thing. I tend to prefer it being dead, and in most cases cooked, prior to consumption. Not to mention it’s pretty difficult to eat something that’s living, they tend to disagree with it. Now, I do have the sense to not eat like an animal – I cook most of my food in some way prior to eating it which actually puts me above animals, ’cause they can’t cook or season foods. That being said, I take full advantage of my omnivorous physical traits and enjoy both meat and veggies.
AMEN, AMEN!
Just an editing note – In Nina’s article it mentions the Asians eating only two TEASPOONS a day.. and you said two TABLESPOONS in your paragraph after it… you might want to fix that
.-= Meagan´s last blog ..Fruity Vegan Oatmeal Bake =-.
Great article! You did an excellent job summing up the current arguments against soy. Just a question: In your first quote by Nina Planck it says that Asians eat a total of 2 teaspoons a day of soy. In your next paragraph you re-state this fact except you say that they eat a total of two tablespoons. Which is correct?
Thanks again. I’m going to forward this to a few friends!
Katie
Katie & Meagan — Thanks! Fixed.
@jillianmichaels already preached!! RT @Kathy_Valentine: @FoodRenegade Not convinced yet about dangers of soy? Read this http://su.pr/2BpRoa
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Dan — Tofu originated around the 2nd century BC in China, and it was made from fermented bean curd. That is how it was traditionally made before the days of refrigeration. Most modern tofu isn’t fermented anymore. You can still buy varieties of fermented tofu (aka “Stinky Tofu” or “Pickled Tofu”) in some Asian markets, though.
Furthermore, the stats regarding Asian consumption of soy products includes tofu, so the original point still stands. Asians eat ridiculously small amounts of soy compared to a westerner eating the standard American diet (which is saturated with soy oils and protein in most processed foods), let alone a “health-crazed” westerner trying to eat 100g of the stuff per day!
Step away from the soy: http://bit.ly/6yptz (I’m amazed so many people who are into healthful, local, artisan food eat soy.)
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Dangers of soyhttp://bit.ly/IjV3j
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Concerning soy products, does that also include eating the soy beans in the pod?
i was wondering the same thing i LOVE some boiled soy beans!
an article on the dangers of soy: http://bit.ly/IjV3j
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Interesting article: http://bit.ly/IjV3j
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Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
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Hi Kristen, this is an intriguing post.
I still don’t get this point about soy and tofu. You said that Asian consumption of soy products includes tofu, but they only eat on average 2 teaspoons when they eat it in dishes? This seems a little unbelievable to me. Is tofu not a traditional item included in stir fries and other Asian meals?
If soy is bad, are people not supposed to eat tofu or edamame either? Is tofu OK to eat if you’re combining it with other fermented items like fish sauce and tamari?
Sorry, I don’t mean to be argumentative, I’m just confused about this all.
.-= Amy P.´s last blog ..FeedBurner Terms of Service Update =-.
Soy may not be good for us after all http://bit.ly/IjV3j #organic #realfood #health
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Dangers of soy? You decide. http://tr.im/z1d4
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Amy P. — You got it. According to the surveys, Asians eat an average of only 2 teaspoons of soy product a day. It is usually NOT the centerpiece of the meal, but rather added to it like a condiment. Remember, too, that this is an average. So, it’s possible they don’t eat hardly any soy for three days, then have it with a meal and consume 6 teaspoons of it.
And, yes, people should not eat unfermented soy products like unfermented tofu, straight edamame, soy milk, etc.
Michelle — If those soy beans aren’t fermented, then you should avoid them.
Since I have hypothyroidism, I have avoided all soy foods (which I don’t really like anyway), with one exception – soy sauce. I’ve never used huge amounts of it anyway because of the saltiness (and I use the reduced sodium kind). Should I be totally avoiding soy sauce as well? I love the taste of it, but I’m sure I could learn to live without it, especially if even a small amount is still affecting my thyroid. Thanks!
~janella~
Janella — If the soy sauce is naturally-fermented, it should be fine in moderation. Of course, it’s best to get an unpasteurized, fermented soy sauce, but those are harder to come by. Ultimately, though, it’s your decision. Are you doing things to promote thyroid health like eating mineral rich REAL sea salt? Avoiding other goitrogens? You get the idea. If the soy sauce is one of many compromises, then maybe it’s best to avoid it. If it’s the sole one, then occasional use shouldn’t hurt.
Can thyroid damage caused by soy be reversed ?
I learned this a while ago but this explains it better RT @ZenOfHealth Food Renegade » Blog Archive » Dangers of Soy http://bit.ly/2oxEq7
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Thank you, Kristen. I do use real sea salt when I use salt. Looks like I have to do some research on other goitrogens, however – I don’t have a clue about them at all.
Food Renegade » Blog Archive » Dangers of Soy http://bit.ly/Q0kg9
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Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
RT @cheeseslave: Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
RT @cheeseslave: Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
Food Renegade » Blog Archive » Dangers of Soy http://bit.ly/118DHs
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Great post! I’ve long been concerned with the push to drink soy milk and eat soy burgers to replace meat and milk. We already live in an endocrine interrupting world and eating so much soy just exacerbates the problem.
Karla
.-= Living A Whole Life´s last blog ..Great Read: Healthy Child Healthy World =-.
The dangers of soy: http://bit.ly/6yptz #food #organic #farm #agriculture
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Dangers of Soy | Food Renegade: After decades of hearing marketing spin about how soy is a wonder food, a protei.. http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
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Dangers of Soy | Food Renegade http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
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This was an excellent article! Thank you so much for posting it. Don’t forget about all the farmers out there who are feeding their animals soy based feed because it is cheap and because the farmers, even good ones, are convinced that their animals cannot live without the protein in soy. This is just not true. And when we eat animal products from animals fed soy, we are eating soy. Especially when we eat eggs from soy-fed chickens, even pastured chickens because they are still getting some grains and it is usually soy based. It took me a long time, but I finally found a local source for pastured, soy-free eggs. I am now working on locating soy-free chicken for meat. I have tried to educate local farmers but, being a city girl, I don’t have much credibility even though I know a lot about this! Thanks again for a fabulous article.
What about those of us who have been eating/drinking soy our entire lives? Allergic to milk since birth I have always used it in place of milk. Am I damaged?
Anything too much for anyone is no good. Besides each of our body is made up differently, some can eat certain food and be ok with it., some would get a reaction. Who then can decide that something is really good or really bad. I don’t think soy is really bad for you. As an Asian, I made soy bean milk. There is some processing to make it, but it’s not a ferment product. Asian had been drinking this for years. I am sorry but after all these hypes about how something are really good for you, then there are the opposes. There are doubs in my mind always when I read something anymore. You even said it yourself, there are funded articles to promote, so by the same token, there would be funded “demote” articles. One can only judge for oneself. Listen to your body is the best rule.
Listening to your body will likely produce a cancer or other serious consequence years from now. You may not have any reaction in real time but as a “for instance” ~ how do you know the consequences of GMO Soy products? NO ONE KNOWS! Two or three generations from now we may get information that the eating of GMO Soy (which is nearly all of it) causes … fill in the blank.
Thi — The independent research that has been done on soy is just that — independent. The people doing these studies are truly not profiting by publishing studies demoting soy. If anything, they are being hurt by it because of how long-reaching the arm of the soy industry is in the U.S. They are putting their professional reputations and credibility on the line in order to come out and say these things.
Also, according to the most comprehensive account of soymilk’s history, its use was rare before the 20th century and widespread usage was highly unlikely. In other words, it’s not a traditional food. It’s the Asian equivalent of margarine or hot bath canning — something newfangled, industrialized, and processed.
Jana — Yes. If you’ve been regularly drinking soy milk your entire life, you should definitely worry about the damage you’ve been doing to your thyroid and to your endocrine system.
Amy — Excellent point.
The Dangers of Soy. Food Renegade: http://tr.im/z3PB < soy everything, a marketing coup & the bane of lazy vegetarians
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So, which is worst (if you’re forced to choose) — pasteurized cow’s milk or soy “milk”? We were faced with this situation the other day.
And what is “commentluv” at the bottom of your page, Kristen? I’m scared to click on it until I know what it is! LOL
Great article. One point you missed: most non-organic soy is genetically modified, these days.
.-= Kathryn´s last blog ..Mish mash =-.
Dangers of Soy | Food Renegade: After decades of hearing marketing spin about how soy is a wonder food, a protei.. http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
Dangers of Soy | Food Renegade http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
Excellent article and helpful information Kristen – thanks for posting.
Teresa — Thanks!
Kathryn — Excellent point. So very true.
Christina — Hard call. Is the pasteurized cow’s milk from grass-fed cows or mostly grass-fed cows? If yes, then it’s a slam dunk for the pasteurized cow’s milk. If not, then I’d try to make a third way. Maybe that coconut milk tonic I posted a couple days ago?
Oh, and CommentLuv is for those readers who have blogs of their own. Ever notice how after some reader comments there’s a little box highlighting their last post? That’s CommentLuv in action. It’d pop up for you to use if you’d enter a web address in the comment form.
I love this article by @foodrenegade – http://bit.ly/IjV3j . Take THAT you dagone Vegans! j/k
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Dangers of Soy | Food Renegade http://bit.ly/2wpHUH
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OK, so I have been eating 1 soy-based “ice cream” bar per day, for the past couple of years (Tofutti). The 5th ingredient is Isolated Soy protein, and the 6th is tofu…how much soy is too much, or at least how much would one need to consume to start experiencing real health problems?
Zero would be the correct amount of daily soy consumption. While some rats can exist/live on the glue found in cardboard they are not what you call healthy rats ~ you may be able to tolerate some soy for years.
Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
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RT @cheeseslave Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
Ever since my mom’s estrogen positive breast cancer I’ve been studying how to control my own estrogen dominance and to take steps to be as breast healthy as possible. My naturapathic doctor specializes in endocrinology and she let me in on the secret that we get so much disguised soy already in our diets already (and industrial corn also) that we don’t need to eat any more soy and to use it only in extreme moderation. (especially with my history)
I like what you said about fermented soy. It gives me back my soy but let’s me know one good for me form of it. I’ll miss my soy milk, but at 47 I’ve already had a lifetime of modern chemicals, pesticides, hormones, and industrial foods to take this lightly. All anyone can do is to slowly reverse those trends in your life eat whole foods and only eat processed foods (most foods in packages made from whole foods into new forms) in moderation. When it comes to health claims exhorting us to eat more of something, one size does not fit all and don’t believe the hype!
Wow! I knew soy wasn’t great, which is why as a vegetarian I try to limit it and have been happy that I only have daughters instead of boys because of the estrogen factor, but I had no idea how bad it was! I have been too overwhelmed by all the information out there to do my own studing, so I am very thankful to you for writing this comprehensive post. I have linked to it on my breastfeeding blog beause of the soy formula quote. Astonishing! Do you mind if I ask you where you got that information?
I’m so glad I found your site. You’re a couple steps ahead of me as far as the slow food movement and nutrition thing goes so I feel like I will learn a lot from you. Thanks for hosting a great carnival too!
.-= Melodie´s last blog post …Foodie Fridays: Summer Fresh Salsa =-.
Melodie — That info came from Lierre Keith, author of The Vegetarian Myth. I haven’t yet read her book, although the excerpt I heard in that podcast I just linked to made me really want to. Her writing style is refreshingly good, and it makes me want to listen to what she’s got to say even if I may not agree with her on every point.
Laura — I’m with you. I’ve already eaten too many industrialized, processed foods in my life to take proper nutrition lightly any more.
Deb — I’d say that there’s already so much soy hidden in the average American diet that even toffuti is going a bit too far. That said, if you DON’T eat the average American diet and instead stick to Real Food and heatlhy fats, then perhaps eating soy like the Asians do — in small quantities, with other nutrient-dense foods — is okay. But I’d pretty much ALWAYS avoid toffuti, though, since it’s an industrialized food. Why not go some other frozen dairy alternative that isn’t so bad for you, like frozen coconut cream?
If YOUR BABY IS getting rec amt of soy formula = same estrogen as in 4 birth control pills. T or F? Read on. http://bit.ly/hD5Nj
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Very informative post. I’ve been doing some research of my own for a post I’ve been wanting to do. I’ve found several of the same issues you’ve mentioned here. I started watching my soy intake when the research indicating its link to cancer came out several years ago. Lately I’ve been learning even more about possible dangers. Thanks for all the information and resources.
.-= Lori´s last blog post …Cooking Is a Necessity =-.
I only skimmed through the comments. I’ll just stand by and agree that soy will kill your thyroid… It certainly killed mine and I now jave the exact syptoms described above. It sucks.
im w u dave… i have had severe chronic health problems for EXACTLY the same amount of time as Soy was introduced into my diet. Been off for nearly 6 years now, unfortunately the damage to my digestive tract and ultimately my whole body has been MUCH harder to overcome than to come by.
o if only we knew then wot we know today….
Older-Sadder-Sicker-but Wiser
btw- i was one of those (previously very healthy) Lacto-Ovo veg types who fell for the Soy SuperFood hype in a BIG way, when my then 2 year old was discovered allergic to both eggs & cow. that was over 10 years ago now… was looking at the old home movies last nite and watching how my physical appearance changed and gradually became so sickly and aged in such a short time *sigh* …too bad it took something like 4-5 years to figure out the connection to Soy, i really believe there has been a lot of permanent damage. But i also really believe i would be dead today & my boys w/o a mum if i hadnt realized in time, and after 6 years off soy i am doing much better than when i was daily being poisoned by the stuff
Now i give thanx for every day with my boys, & doing my best to educate them so they might avoid the same toxic state!
No one will ever be able to convince me “isolated soy proteins” are a good thing ever again, my own damaged health is proof enough for me
Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
Hi,
I have enjoyed the Fight Back Friday. I don’t serve my family Soy. I can tell a difference in my body if I eat soy.
I look forward to exploring more of yor blog.
Blessings,
Elizabeth
.-= Elizabeth´s last blog post …Real Foods =-.
RT @cheeseslave: Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu [interesting read]
http://su.pr/2BpRoa Did you know that the recommended amount soy baby formula has the equivalent estrogen of 4 birth control pills?
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Is soya a healthy food choice? http://www.qicute.com/?oj16
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A few years ago, I convinced myself I was lactose-intolerant (I seemed to always get an upset stomach when I drank milk) and switched to soy milk. I decided to cut out dairy for a month and even switched to soy yogurt. I was probably consuming soy dairy products 3-4 times a day. The effect on my body was similar to when I switched from a low-dose birth control to a higher dose one — I was one crazy lady. To top it all off, I still had an upset stomach, probably from all the excess fiber in my diet. I went off soy cold turkey and switched to grass-fed dairy and feel great now. I later talked to my mom and realized that the “lactose intolerance” I was experience was eerily similar to my sulfa drug allergy — which was probably in the conventional milk I was drinking in the past.
Did anyone catch the Dr. Oz show yesterday? Sept.18th. http://www.doctoroz.com/ He was promoting soy milk, apparently Silk is one of his sponsors. Scary to think of the masses of people he’s reaching with the kind of influence he has.
What is the source of your claim “we’ve seen such a dramatic rise in precocious puberty with young girls starting their periods at 6 and 7″. Precocious Puberty is a fairly rare disorder caused by specific glandular and/or neurological problems. Age of Menarche has been falling steadily for over a century (see http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/111/4/844), but I think that is attributed to more general dietary patterns and weight gain.
Hi Dave –
As far as I know, there is no study done linking the rise in instances of precocious puberty to dietary intake of soy. But there are numerous studies which document a rise in precocious puberty, both in the U.S. and in other countries. I did a quick Google search for “rise in precocious puberty” and found too many sources to list.
There are numerous papers speculating about why this increase is happening. My particular source for the idea that dietary intake of soy could be a contributing factor to the rise in precocious puberty is Lierre Keith, author of The Vegetarian Myth.
Of course, I don’t think intake of soy is the ONLY factor, but I do think we need to carefully examine all the hormone-mimicking chemicals and foods we come in contact with as potential culprits.
Hope that helps!
Since soy is in so many processed foods in the form of soybean oil and soy lecithin, the problem is increased. I try to stay away from soy products as much as possible since I tend to have low grade hypothyroidism and estrogen dominance. Thank you for posting this!
.-= carla´s last blog post …A Small Vent about SIGG =-.
Dangers of Soy http://short.to/r12s
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The dangers of soy http://bit.ly/OTJnv by @foodrenegade
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Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu
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Really interesting article attached to your tweet. thanks 4 the info! RT @vinmiller The dangers of soy http://bit.ly/OTJnv by @foodrenegade
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So how would one get rid of estrogen dominance? I don’t eat soy beans or soy milk, etc, but am concerned about my thyroid after reading your post. Any thoughts on how to increase the functioning of your thyroid?
Maria — Good question! I’m researching a post on estrogen dominance right now, which is where the idea for this post on the dangers of soy was born. I’m also going to write a post on the Thyroid next in my Understanding The Keys to Health series. A few tips to last you until then: eat more coconut oil as its medium chain fatty acids help the Liver digest Vitamin A, take fermented cod liver oil so that you can get more Vitamin A, and make sure you’re getting enough real iodine in your diet (via real, unrefined sea salt, if possible).
I’m a believer in moderation, but think soy use at the level in western diet has legitimate concerns. http://ow.ly/qm2X Dangers of Soy
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Great post!
Hey I wanted to mention that in Lierre Kieth’s book, near the end, she writes about precocious puberty and how it is MUCH higher in African American girls in the US. She makes the correlation between African American girls who are fed soy formula, because they can get the free formula via the WIC program.
I wish I could quote her exactly but the book is on my Kindle which needs to be charged.
Please go listen to this interview with Sally Fallon Morell that just aired yesterday — so much great information about why unfermented soy is bad for you — even just one cup of soy milk per day:
http://www.heritageradionetwork.com/programs/2-Q-Report
.-= CHEESESLAVE´s last blog post …Update on Kate’s Anemia =-.
Thanks for the link to the interview with Sally Fallon Morell! I hadn’t heard it yet.
Kristen/Maria -
You really can’t get much iodine from sea salt. If you want to supplement iodine (which I personally think everyone should do since we’re all getting soy/fluoride/bromide etc. in our water/food/environment which block iodine uptake), the recommended supplements are Iodoral and Lugol’s.
You can try to get iodine from food if you prefer — the best source is fish broth that is made with the heads of fish. That is traditionally what the Japanese, who eat the most soy (still very little) always eat with their fermented soy. Miso is traditionally eaten at every meal in Japan and it is made from bonito, which includes the heads of the fish. The heads are where the thyroid is, which is where the iodine is stored.
Incidentally, Dr. Weston Price wrote about how native people around the world ate a lot more iodine than we do in our modern diet. The
“…the foods of the native Eskimos contained 5.4 times as much calcium as the displacing foods of the white man, five times as much phosphorus, 1.5 times as much iron, 7.9 times as much magnesium, 1.8 times as much copper, 49.0 times as much iodine, and at least ten times that number of fat-soluble vitamins. For the Indians of the far North of Canada, the native foods provided 5.8 times as much calcium, 5.8 times as much phosphorus, 2.7 times as much iron, 4.3 times as much magnesium, 1.5 times as much copper, 8.8 times as much iodine, and at least a ten fold increase in fat-soluble activators.”
He wrote about the Indians who went to great lengths to procure kelp and dried eggs, “so that they would not get ‘big necks’ like the whites.’”
http://iodine4health.com/special/weston_price.htm
.-= CHEESESLAVE´s last blog post …Update on Kate’s Anemia =-.
Sorry I meant to say dried fish eggs not dried eggs.
OK and I found the quote from Lierre Keith about African-American girls, precocious puberty and soy formula. This is shocking and horrible, and everyone needs to know about it, which is why I took the time to look it up:
“…14.7 percent of Caucasian girls show signs of puberty by age eight. But for African-American girls, that rate is 48.3 percent. That’s basically half.”
She says, “So where’s the soy in this story? WIC (Women, Infants & Children) is the federal food distribution program for the poor. It give out a lot of [free] infant formula.”
She goes on to say, “According to a Government Accountability Office (GAO) report, “Infants were least likely to be breastfed if their mothers were under 20 years old, not college-educated, unmarried or the infants were African-American.”
.-= CHEESESLAVE´s last blog post …Update on Kate’s Anemia =-.
This is an excellent and interesting post. I learned a lot from your research and from the comments. Linking soy to the vegetarian diet has made it seem healthy to many people for a long time. But heck, all sorts of crazy food are meat free, eh?
.-= Lee´s last blog post …Our Harmony Valley Farmshare Arrives Again! =-.
@bluidsocoluva HAAAA That is awesome… check out this article: http://bit.ly/6yptz
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Excellent post!
By the way an excellant and easy to use source of iodine is Thai Fish Sauce. It is made from fermented fish, usually anchovies. At the end of the process, you have a clear, light brown liquid that is full of nutrients from the fermented fish.. Since the whole fish is used in the fermenting process, you get the iodine from the head.
Sally Fallon recommends Thai Kitchen brand, which I have used for years. You can add the fish sauce to broth, sprinkle it on your food instead of salt, add it to gravies. It is also an excellant substitute for soy sauce.
Stanley Fishman
Author of Tender Grassfed Meat:
Traditional Ways to Cook Grassfed Meat
http://hartkeisonline.com/2009/09/17/at-last-the-secret-to-tender-grassfed-meat-revealed/#more-3664
A far better brand of fish sauce is Red Boat Fish Sauce, which is out of this world! Thai Kitchen contains sugar and to my knowledge is not traditionally fermented. Red Boat is made the old fashioned way, with whole anchovies from pristine waters, fermented with nothing but salt in wooden barrels for a year. Once you try it, you can’t go back. It’s great on everything, Asian food, steamed vegetables, potatoes, eggs, salads, etc. You can make an awesome sauce by blending it with a bit of coconut sugar or honey, finely chopped fresh chilies or chili flakes, shallot or green onion, and lemon or lime juice. Num num.
soy. the new corn. http://bit.ly/IjV3j (via @foodrenegade)
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The more I read the more I find I don’t know anything! I wasn’t aware about the dangers of soy, it makes me rather sad and frustrated with “the experts.” Every day we find out something we were told is good for us is in fact very bad for us.
While it is important to learn about the dangers of certain foods and the benefits of real food I don’t know that we should stress out too much about what we eat as long as we don’t over do any one thing. As they say, in moderation ‘n all.
How do we ever know what is good for us since it changes every day? Most people don’t have the time to research every food we eat. Pretty soon I’m just going to eat tree bark its gotta be just as good for me as most of the products in the stores right?, but then again that breaks the “in moderation rule.”
.-= Earth Friendly Goodies´s last blog post …Lime: the Natural Key to the Fountain of Youth =-.
That’s why I don’t base my opinions on what’s touted for us as “good” or “bad” in the latest politically-correct nutrition craze. Rather, I use history as my guide. I figure we’ve been on this planet for thousands of years, and our bodies have adapted to eating certain kinds of foods. When we eat those foods, we’re healthy. Just look at native people groups eating their traditional diets. They’ve got no chronic diseases, no heart disease, no obesity, no cavities, no degenerative aging. They’re strapping and physically able even into their old age!
Only recently, with the advent of industrialization, have we so altered the nature of our food that what used to be a given simply isn’t anymore. Fifty years ago, all food was local and organic. And, thanks to industrial farming practices the meat, milk, and eggs you buy at the grocery store are fundamentally DIFFERENT than the meat, milk, and eggs you would have bought at the turn of the last century. It’s THESE things which have led to what are now called the “diseases of civilization.”
So, to test whether or not food is good for you, do one thing. Ask yourself this: would your great, great grandmother have recognized it as food? Would her grandmother have? If yes, then by all means eat it. If not, avoid it. This one simple tests eliminates all packaged and processed foods, returns you to healthier, pastured/wild meats & dairy, and gets you eating naturally-occurring healthy fats and avoiding modern yellow seed-based cooking oils (like corn, soybean, & canola). Eat according to traditional wisdom, with pleasure & gratitude , and in classic food combinations, and you’ll be eating a healthy diet.
In general a terrific response to the question of how do I know what to eat. I would question the great grandmother part. Great grandmother was raised on an agriculturally based diet ~ not that of our genetic ancestors, so if they ate it more than 10,000 years ago it is most likely the thing to eat. Hmmn that leaves the wheat, corn, beans and sugar out and puts fresh veg, meat and fruit and nuts in.
Reading @foodrenegade Dangers of Soy http://tinyurl.com/mevdyu – highly recommend it for ppl who consumer soy-based products regularly
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What about soy candles? Obviously they arent ingested but they are advertised as being a healthier alternative to burning petroleum products such as paraffin. Are they really any safer?
.-= Ashley´s last blog post …Green Home – Beeswax Globe Candle – Carved Seasonal =-.
Ashley — Good question. I honestly have NO IDEA. It’d be an interesting thing to research.
I’m a believer in moderation, but think soy use at the level in western diet has legitimate concerns. http://ow.ly/qm2X Dangers of Soy
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You succeeded in scaring me about soy. So I did some online research and have come to the conclusion that your writing is alarmist and over-exaggerated. It’s a shame you have so many readers and people so quickly quote you and Twitter/Facebook about you.
I’m not denying that soy contains phytoestrogens, phytates, trypsin inhibitors and might be termed “goitrogenic. But look at the following:
1. Phytoestrogens. This article is a bit too technical for me to fully understand but one thing is clear and that phytoestrogens are not the same as estrogens. It’s still unclear if phyestrogens actually help or harm. http://www.jacn.org/cgi/content/full/20/suppl_5/354S
2. Phytates. Can actually be a good thing to block overconsumption of minerals which can also be toxic. A balanced diet (or with simple mineral supplementation) can prevent problems. See more info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytic_acid
3. Trypsin inhibitor. Cooking can decrease this.
4. Goitrogenic. If cooked and with sufficient iodine consumption, it’s not an issue. Iodine deficiency can be tested for. See here for more info: http://www.womentowomen.com/hypothyroidism/goitrogenicfoods-thyroidhealth.aspx
Saying things like “soy will destroy your thyroid” is alarmist and just plain false. There’s nothing wrong with questioning soy and bringing up some of the points you did about its nutritional value and how it and its derivatives are showing up in many foods. But condemning it as a dangerous food is just plain false.
Christine,
I don’t feel like I’m being alarmist or false at all based on the research I’ve read. The truth is, you can find a study or an article “proving” just about anything anybody wants to believe. That’s why the point of this blog is to “challenge politically correct nutrition.” You’ll notice I hold to a lot of other “controversial” views about food and health as well. I, for example, think saturated fat and cholesterol are GOOD for you, and I encourage people to eat plenty of butter, eggs, and animal fats. The main reason I believe my views are right and others’ are wrong has to do with my approach to nutrition and food. I believe that we shouldn’t rely on “research” or nutrition science to tell us what to eat. Conventional food wisdom is, in most cases, convoluted and wrong.
Instead, I think what we eat should be determined by centuries of accumulated wisdom. I place a great value on food traditions — particularly those that have been around for thousands of years. I do this because 1)it intuitively makes sense, 2)the human body is adapted to eating this way, and 3)native people groups eating traditional diets untainted by industrialized foods or industrialized food production methods have remarkable health (no cancer, no heart disease, no diabetes, no obesity, no tooth decay, and fully-functional old age).
So, I draw my conclusions about a food’s merit first by asking if it’s traditional (would a great-great grandmother have recognized it as food?), then by seeing what kinds of research (particularly independent research) backs up these claims. In the case of soy, history proves that it is NOT traditional (at least not in the way we consume it), and the independent research says it’s downright dangerous.
While I agree with a lot of what you mentioned, especially the soy-based fake and fast foods, I think it’s worth mentioning that not all traditional and native foods are considered safe or healthy. A very common problem prior to refrigeration was stomach cancer. Processed foods are bad, but butter and animal products are not the best either. The advent of refrigeration has really improved our diets. And our great grandmothers lived a very different lifestyle from most people today. They probably did more manual labor and led a more active lifestyle. Although they may have been eating high caloric foods with animals fats, they had a lower body mass index than we have today. It’s hard to make blanket statements when there are soo many factors to consider.
Jacqleen — I really do think it’s more simple than you think. Read my comment to Earth Friendly Goodies above.
Rock on!!!
for years before i fell for the Soy SuperFood hype, i was predominately Lacto-Ovo veg and very very healthy- Cheeses, Yogurt, plenty of Butter & loads of Eggs were my staples along with whole grains, fruits & vegies.
then my toddler was found to be both Cow & Egg intolerant so i made the switch to Soy as our family’s protein staple… and began my rapid descent into personal health hell.
Soy everything for 4-5 years and i nearly died- no i am NOT being alarmist- my basal metabolism really got that screwed up. now been off for 6 years and doing better, but STILL struggling to find balance and better health again.
my second son was born into that heavy soy period so he got it en utero as well as thru breastmilk & diet for the first 2-3 years of life. he has been small and somewhat frail all his life and suffered from “failure to thrive” syndrome as a toddler.
my whole family now consumes an omnivore diet with no soy except aged tamari, and both my boys are much healthier than they ever were during our years consuming soy!
Christine – Amen to that. Thank you very much for bringing some common sense into this blog. People are being misled here about what they should be eating and I appreciate your comments.
Check out this site: http://www.foodrevolution.org/what_about_soy.htm
This comment was originally posted on Green and Natural Mom Blog
Hi,
Good article, but I have a question about the “preadolescent puberty” piece and how that might be related to soy intake as a kid. From what I have read this is actually attributed to the high levels of hormones in the meat/dairy that people are eating as kids. Do you have any studies to cite the soy-preadolescent puberty thing? after all aren’t most kids on regular, not soy formula?
thanks!
jessica
That’s good to know and hear, because all people ever hear about soy is how wonderful and healthy it is for you. Thanks for the heads up!
-Jack
I have been wondering about the issues with soy in recent times after hearing increasing number of reports about it’s affects on health. This article has surely made me consider giving up soy as I have been consuming it for years.
I have been vegetarian (although not quite 100%) for 24 years and have had very good health in that time. I don’t use soy as my only source of protein or amino acids but it is common in my diet. I’m really going to miss my muesli with soy milk in the mornings though!
….now I’m at a loss of what to replace it with?
When it comes to cow’s milk, I’m still not convinced that it’s a reasonable alternative? …milk is intended for new born infants and then they are eventually weened off. Why are we as adults drinking milk …..and why the hell do we drink cows milk? …cows don’t even drink it!
Anyway, my basic view on diet has been one of eating things that are available naturally and avoiding processed foods as much as possible. If it is processed, I am very particular about the ingredients used and won’t buy anything with ‘numbers’ for example. ….your article has made me realise that I hadn’t applied that approach to soy based products! They are processed foods.
I have recently found a few health related sites and the first was http://www.naturalbias.com which is a fantastic source of information …and it was from one of Vin’s posts on twitter that I found this article.
I have now got a heap more reading to do to re evaluate my view on diet and will be making changes as soon as possible.
Hi Mianne — These are the alternatives to milk I use most often:
http://www.foodrenegade.com/healthy-milk-substitutes-with-recipes/
On March 17, 2008 I began the Nutrisystem diet. By April I could no longer eat without violent vomiting, severe chest pain, sore muscles (the fractured rib kind) and joint pain. No doctor has diagnosed or warned of the dangers of a soy allergy in all of the months passed, although I mention it immediately. I have eaten soy for many years in small doses. Those of you who show no symptoms and wish to continue your present diets, learn the symptoms. After the past 3 weeks of diarrhea, I knew it was necessary to eat and drink, so 2 days ago I took a TLC mocha bar with me for lunch. I meant to take a non-soy bar. But I ate it and felt very full and fine. That is because it takes 24 hours for the blood to produce enough histamine to attack your next intake of protein, in my case, egg whites. Another exhausting, sickening 24 hours has been wasted again with the classic symptoms because I did not learn about the 24-hour cycle until late last night when I found a medical paper on it. An antihistamine is needed for living with this allergy unless you suffer the more serious symptom of anaphalactic shock, which can be fatal if not treated by injection of epinephrine or adrenaline.
When there is this much mystery surrounding a food product I believe the manufacturers know of the danger and bury it. Thanks a lot FDA.
I strongly encourage readers of this article to do more research. To criticize soy while touting dairy products would baffle most nutritionists, who, at least in the moderately-progressive suburb of Washington, D.C. in which I live, will be quick to remind his/her patients that dairy products are rich in fats (the wrong ones), cholesterol, and additives and ingredients that won’t appear on any label, like, for example, PUS. That’s right. And dairy farmers acknowledge this. They even invented a system to measure the amount of pus and bacteria in produced milk–not that it did any good, since most states don’t adhere to it anyway. And why should they be forced to, when the FDA and USDA are able to brainwash and manipulate the American people so easily?
For a reaction to a similar article blaspheming soy, you can visit this site: http://www.foodrevolution.org/mothering.htm, but the PCRM is also an excellent source for unbiased information from actual–wait for it, wait for it–physicians.
If you really think the flesh of another animal (because we’re animals too, in case you forgot) or milk intended for a baby cow are better for humans than a plant which has been used–and not just two teaspoons a day–for centuries, you have more reading to do. The Okinawa Centenarian Study can be easily Googled and will prove what scientists and nutritionists alike have been saying for years: that a plant-based diet is the single best thing a human can do for both his/her own health and for the health of the world. Just ask the people of Okinawa, who are considered to be the healthiest in the world, and who eat TWO SERVINGS OF SOY-BASED FOODS PER DAY. In fact, soy makes up 12% of the average diet.
The author makes a point in one of her comments about the evolution of the human diet, and I think that is a good distinction to make–but not the way it was phrased. Hundreds of years ago, the food industry wasn’t a corporate behemoth that was responsible for billions of dollars in government-subsidized revenue. And, for the most part, we didn’t have much choice when it came to our diets. But now? Creating and destroying life for human consumption is barbaric and antiquated. We’ve found better, plant-based options since then–healthier, more sustainable options–which are globally recognized to be the most beneficial of any other lifestyle. As many recent food-related documentaries such as Food, Inc. and Fast Food Nation have noted, truth in the food industry is all but absent. I would encourage people to look at what goes into the foods they’re eating–to say nothing of the disgusting treatment of living creatures for food–and make decisions based on health, not habit.
“The time will come when men such as I will look upon the murder of animals as now they look upon the murder of men.” –Leonardo da Vinci
Kristin –
I believe you’ve unfairly misrepresented me.
If you were a regular reader of this blog, you’d know that I in no way encourage people to eat factory-farmed foods. In fact, I particularly discourage people from eating factory-farmed, industrialized animal products. And, I regularly take the food industry to task for its misinformation. It’s in that spirit that I wrote this post. I’m taking the soy industry to task for the misinformation and lies they spread. I advocate a return to traditional foods — real foods as they’ve been grown and prepared for the hundreds and thousands of years we’ve been around (and long before industrialization).
For more information on where I’m coming from, check out these articles:
The Basics
The Vegetarian Myth
Healthy Foods: What To Buy
Thanks!
We’ve started to offer soy -free eggs from our truly free range/pastured chickens. Due to my concerns of soy as a hormone disruptor and my son’s allergy to soy – and learning more about the dangers of soy . We’re located 25 miles SW of Portland, Oregon.
bless you Annie – as soon as it is Spring i will come visit yr farm!
The modern appeal of soy is that it is a dirt-cheap source of all essential amino acids. It also is extremely high in protein for a plant food. Farmers rely on it to help bloated Holsteins produce much more milk per day, and to allow industrially-raised animals like hogs and chickens to grow more quickly. Even my local dairy farmer uses it in goat feed to help his goats produce more milk. There are other legumes and specialty grains which provide good nutrition, but they are neither as readily available nor are they as cheap. The economics of soy feed are very hard to escape.
Of course, this may change once the effects of soy feed are more firmly quantified. (Using the amino-acid profile of a legume as the sole quantifier of its nutritive value is simplistic; one might as well claim that a freshly cooked medium-rare steak is no more nutritious than the same cut of meat overcooked into shoe leather, and stored in the refrigerator for 2 weeks.) I have noticed a LARGE difference between soy products made from GMO soy, and fresh organic soybeans (edamame) straight from the field. I was unduly skittish about all things soy until I tried a Taiwanese “long bean salad” made of pickled long beans, cooked ground beef, and edamame. They are quite delicious, like many other mildly goitrogenic foods — cabbage, tahini, pine nuts, millet, etc. Where products like Silk Soymilk (made from organic, non-GMO soybeans) fall on the spectrum from industrial GMO soy-product to fresh local heritage edamame, I can only speculate.
I look forward to the day when farmers can know the exact effects of soy feed, and what traces it leaves in milk, eggs, and flesh from otherwise healthy pastured animals.
One final thought — tofu is significantly different from soy milk, and the “real thing” is quite good, albeit inferior to products like miso and tempeh. It is very possible that most of the anti-nutrients and unpleasant oils are in the discarded liquids rather than the solid foodstuff. I find most American supermarket tofu to be bland but acceptable, but in China (speaking from experience) it can be downright tasty. There is an extra dimension of flavor to fresh tofu in Asian countries that’s hard to describe — like describing the difference between supermarket cabbage and farmer’s market cabbage. BTW, I have heard that some Asian immigrants in the United States search out specialty producers to get the freshest, tastiest version (just as many Europeans look for artisanal bread similar to that found in their country of origin).
im veg. what the hell am i supposed to eat now? straight up vegetables dont fill me up..and eating meat, well thats not going to happen.
I have never seen anything address edamame. Does anyone know if this falls into the “not a good idea to eat” catagory.
Soy is highly over-rated as a health food. Follow the money and it goes right back to the industry that processes so much of it. That is often a good way to determine if something is really as good as all the advertising claims it to be.
Thank you for the article. I would like to direct you to Dr. Jeffrey Bland and the vast amount of research he has done that indicate quite the opposite of your presentation of soy. Phytoestrogens are not estrogen, they are modulators of receptors. Non-GMO soy is used in many of the formulas in the Metagenics line of products (www.metagenics.com) They do have a position paper on this topic, an interesting read. Yes, there are some who are actually allergic to or have digestive issues with soy, but that may also be an actual digestive issue, similar to any response someone may have to a food substance to which they are sensitive.
Eric — Thanks for visiting the site. Please read my comment to Christine above, as I think it addresses how I view the research that nutritional scientists do (and as such, is an answer to your point).
Cheers,
~KristenM
Thanks for all this insightful information everyone! I have a concern.. I have been eating organic “veggie” fed eggs purchased from both my local health-food store and my local supermarket thinking I am eating healthy eggs.. I only realize now that they are fed soy! I have endometriosis, so I am wondering how badly this may have affected me? How much estrogen or soy may have passed into the eggs? I recently joined the traditional nutrition guild where I can buy eggs from chickens fed a non-soy diet, so hopefully this is the better alternative.
I have read that unfermented soy is indeed bad for us, that it can contribute to breast cancer and affect thyroid function. I used to eat veggie soy protein burgers at least four time a week and many other products rich in soy protein, flour, etc. Now I avoid unfermented soy like the plague. It disturbs me that Dr. Oz (who I love and generally agree with) promotes soy burgers so much. Like Christina, I am now realizing that even some of the organic eggs from cage free chickens are fed soy protein.
Thanks so much for this informative article! I realized last summer that I am very allergic to soy and have since cut it out completely. I have found so many other wonderful foods that I don’t miss it at all. It did put a cramp in my coffee drinking, but that’s a good thing, too!
What about using soy for menopausal women? I have read there are many benefits.
I disagree. I’ve been a vegetarian for over 20 years and have no ill-side effects or thyroid issues. Nice to think we could all enjoy grass fed wild animals as a part of regular diet in America, but not likely. I’ll stick to non-animal proteins, including soy, and avoid factory farmed meat. I’m interested to see how long you can tout this high fat/cholesterol diet for, I think it’s a sham. For some another insight on soy and high fat diets please read:
http://www.foodrevolution.org/what_about_soy.htm.
The nefarious effects of soy in your article sure opened my eyes, but it’s not the entire story by a long shot and I have serious doubts about the effectiveness of vivisection and studies that rely on it. Enjoy your steak.
Scott–the cholesterol in foods has little to do with cholesterol levels in our bodies (only 15% of the cholesterol in our bodies is attributable to food sources); the whole “low fat diet” concept is a myth, as well. Read Gary Taubes’ “Good Calories, Bad Calories.” He does exhaustive research on these subjects (and I do mean exhaustive–hundreds of pages and a very broad and deep inspection of studies, scientists, etc.).
That said, I agree with this blog, that eating healthy is “intuitive” and shouldn’t be based around the latest research. Avoiding processed foods and sticking to whole foods, locally raised when you can. Grass fed animal products. Local, responsibly grown fruits and veggies. At farmer’s markets, you can ask the farmers how they raise the food they sell; you can’t do that in a grocery store. Eating organic when you can’t get local is the next best thing. It is simple, it’s just that we are given too many choices (non-food choices, I should say, since most of what is in the grocery store is just that).
I have a vegetarian friend who has PCOS; bad acne on her face, neck and back. She continues to eat a lot of soy–her naturopath recommends it for her, apparently, since she isn’t allergic. She drinks soy milk, eats tofu, etc. pretty much every day. Her PCOS has not gone away; in fact, when I looked at her skin the other day, it looked worse. I tried to reason with her about it, but she got very defensive, said soy was good for her and that “everyone said so.” Everyone, meaning her doctor and Dr. Oz. I’ve read Lierre Keith’s The Vegetarian Myth, and while it’s a good book, I think it would be too much for her right now. I like Nina Planck, think I’ll send her the article with no comments attached; don’t want to be preachy, but what she’s doing to her body is concerning. Thanks for this blog.
Kidney stones! I don’t think anyone mentioned that soybeans contains oxalate, a compound that can bind with calcium in the kidney to form kidney stones. I only know this because a long time vegetarian I know had to have surgery for kidney stones recently, the doctor analized his diet and said it was the excessive use of tofu as a meat substitute that was the culprit.
Scott,
I will enjoy my steak.
I hope you enjoy your estrogen.
Cheers,
i am so disturbed. my son who is now 1.5 yrs old has been on soy due to an allergy to dairy since he was a newborn (alternated soy formula and breastmilk). He is short statured for his age but so is father and I. I am Asian (did not drink any cow’s milk growing up) and his dad African American (drank formula, cow’s milk)
I am very concerned that we have done irreparable harm to our little one. What can we do? Right now I am researching milk alternatives but the main concern is long term damage.
I’m no expert, but I’d say don’t freak out about it. Just don’t feed it to him anymore.
As for an alternative is soy milk, if you’re brave, you could try finding a safe source of raw dairy. The farmer(s) should be OCD about germs. There are still too many outbreaks of food related illness linked to raw milk. However, I have been raising goats for almost a year now and have been drinking my milk raw (and I have OCD
, and I have never gotten really sick with anything. And ANY store bought dairy products make me ill, even if it’s milk cooked in something else.
I don’t believe in miracle foods, but raw milk is the closest thing I have found to one. I’ve been healed from things I didn’t know were really problems.
Great article, it is not too often that you see the truth laid out so clearly. I work with a lot of patients with thyroid problems and soy is always a part of our initial conversation. Oprah’s up and down weight has probably affected her hypothalamus and pituitary glands as well. These glands give control to the thyroid and must not be overlooked.
Thanks for this article. I really had no idea. I don’t actually eat soy, but have been looking for ways to get more protein. I will look to other options now.
.-= Robin´s last blog post …“Week without Mirrors” Challenge Report =-.
Wow. Someone in this string of posts was concerned about some “Dr. Oz” reaching people with conventional media. I would have to Google him because I have no clue who he is. Kristen, it’s an interesting opinion you present, I just wish the internet would require some sort of disclaimer. A friend actually directed me to your blog as “proof” that we had harmed my son with the use of soy based infant formula (on the recommendation of our naturopath) when we could no longer breast feed and he developed skin rashes when we started milk based formula. But your “research” comes from a foundation with this in their “about us” page: “Specific goals include establishment of universal access to clean, certified raw milk and a ban on the use of soy formula for infants.” If that isn’t research with an agenda (in my opinion every bit as bad as industry sponsored research) then I do not know what is.
Matt, you sure hit the nail on the head. Almost EVERY “eye opening” nutrition/medicine based article one reads has an agenda behind it, whether it’s Big Pharma, Supplement Makers, Food Industry A, Food Industry B, Agricultural Groups, Doctors, Naturopaths, Evangelicals, Exporters…and the list goes on. It is so hard to separate fact from fiction. (Heck, it’s hard enough for even UNBIASED science — to the extent it exists — to do that!) The “soy expose” here may very well have some nuggets of truth, aplicable to a select group of people, but things are surely distorted, one-sided, overblown and incomplete. But the same could be said about a blog *extolling* soy as a wonderfood that will cure all ills. Sigh.
What scares the be-jeebus out of me is that so many people read this stuff and just take it as gospel because it sounds logical. “OMG, thank you for letting me know the truth!!” The ubiquitous “I know it’s true because I read it on the net!” syndrome is almost as scary to me as environmental and food pollutants. It especially amazes me that people routinely cite “eye-opening” websites “that explain it all”…without considering that JUST MAYBE they should be a little skeptical if the site has a product(s) for sale??
The part about eating what our great-grandmothers would eat may be wise when it comes to some foods, but ridiculously simplistic and VERY unwise when it comes to others. My great grandmother smoked up a storm, used lard by the barrel-full, and obviously was not familar with today’s food-safety and hygiene guidelines. And as another pointed out, she got hugely more exercise working her farm than the average American would today — and weighed a lot less And don’t forget, lifespans are a lot longer today than they were in “great grandma’s” day, especially when comparing like socio-economic groups. The reference to “native people” being so healthly is particularly preposterous and overgeneralized.
Hi Rick,
I just had to respond to your comment that “lifespans are a lot longer today…” While the average life expectancy has increase, it’s not because we are living longer: it’s because we have reduced the infant mortality rate. If you walk through any old cemetery, you’ll find multiple gravemarkers listed people dying when they were in their 100s. For example, John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, all lived into their 80s and 90s. Of course, you could argue they were upper class, but when I did my genealogy, it was reflected in my ancestors too (they were lower class).
Average life expectancy is simple, but misleading math. If you have 100 people and 50 of them died when they are one years old and the other 50 die when they are 90, the average life expectancy is 45 years old. While 45 years old is technically true, it’s more accurate to say: if you could make it past childhood, you’ll probably live to 90 (in this example). Obviously, life’s still a game of chance, but basically if you made it past your first year of life (and maybe a couple more years of childhood), you had about the same chances then as now to make it to old age.
Not to mention, there’s all the hype about how we are all dying younger now anyway.
Finally, while I agree that everyone shouldn’t just accept anything as fact, it does allow them to research and come to their own conclusions. Personally, I support the “what did my ancestors eat” idea. Though, I’m sure many people can survive and thrive on the SAD, I can’t. I prefer to look to what my great-great-great-great-great-great-(keep going) grandmother did. And of course, that would vary for everyone: Aborigines, obviously ate different foods from Eskimos. Basically, there’s no perfect way.
Perhaps if one comes from a family of chain-smokers who had short lifespans, the advice is unwise.
I look at my family tree, and I see the lifespans dropping by the generation, with a corresponding decrease in health. Four generations ago, several of my direct ancestors passed their 105th birthdays. My 4xg-grandfather immigrated to Canada at the age of 60, then eight years later, remarried (after his wife died) and fathered six more children. My great-grandfather was living completely independently until his death at 97. My father and his siblings, though …. diabetes, high blood pressure, heart problems. I’ll be surprised if any of the six of them see 70.
I don’t know what my great-grandparents ate, but I know what my grandfather ate, and I can work on recreating that for my family.
But what about those who are badly lactose intolerant? My sister can only drink soy milk right now (told by her dietician) and can’t touch anything with lactose in it, including most other kinds of milk (she may be able to handle goat’s milk, but they can’t get it where we live, waaaay up in rural B.C.). Soy milk is the only way she can get anything resembling calcium and many proteins as well…
Shai,
There are a LOT of other alternatives to soy milk that don’t have lactose. My personal favorites, and recipes, can be found here:
http://www.foodrenegade.com/healthy-milk-substitutes-with-recipes/
I reduced the amount of soy I was eating a few years ago due to similar concerns and as an attempt to figure out why I was having certain health problems…all I can say is, I noticed that I felt better. I usually follow the rule that natural, unprocessed food is best…but for some reason suspended that logic when it came to processed soy products. I also eat butter, red meat on occasion, eggs, cheese, etc. – by all accounts a relatively high fat diet…but always get a clean bill of health at my annual check up…blood pressure, cholesterol, etc. But, I also eat a lot of garlic, olive oil, avocados, black beans, etc. Do not have a car, am very active in my daily life, etc. This reminds me of a similar article I read questioning the effectiveness of sunscreen…all of this makes it very important for us to do our own research, read opposing views, and draw our own conclusions before jumping on any bandwagon.
I live in Trinidad and Tobago West Indies……This info is really mind-blowing……Good for me, i’ve never liked soy products although coming from a family of strict vegetarians…… Thanks a lot
God’s Blessings to everyone…
Thanks for the information… I am curious as to if you have a suggestion for me… I have a 20 month old son who is allergic to whey (dairy), eggs, and peanuts. In order for me to find food in which he can eat I have been feeding him replacements from our local co-op (much of which contain soy), I have been eating what he does also~ I don’t want him to feel different in his own home. I also was using soy milk, but have recently changed to almond milk. He won’t eat meat (I think it is a texture thing?) except for fish, so I am concerned about getting protein to him. What, if anything, is there that I can feed him that does not contain soy? Any advice or suggestions are greatly appreciated. Thank you!
Beans! There are so many different types, kinds, flavors, etc. Beans are loaded with protein, as is quinoa (found in most organic/natural bulk sections of a grocery store). “Milk,” per se, is not necessary in a diet. Everything that is in milk you can get from other foods, mainly vegetables and legumes. Just thought I’d share (my son was allergic to milk, soy, wheat, eggs and rice for his first 9 months – he’s practically vegetarian but likes his grass fed beef hot dogs and adores fish. Yours may enjoy sardines – very good for you). I realize this was 6 months ago, but you never know! Good luck!
This is fantastic. Thank you! I have shared this on my facebook where i have also shared the link to Future of Food, Secrets of Food, another documentary by this french lady and I want to get Food, Inc on there but i can’t find a link for it. Anyways, this is great, thank you so much for sharing. Once you’re informed you gotta spread the word. It’s the only way to make a change in our society and in our world.
I haven’t personally done a critical review of the evidence surrounding soy but honestly, you cannot write an article like this claiming all these scientific findings and then write about Oprah being fat because she ate soy for 10 years. Everything in moderation and we’d all be fine.
… riiight.
I would say, everything in moderation. And as a vegan it is important to keep track on nutrients, especially if one is not accustomed eating this way at first. There has been quite a lot of discussion about that book you mentioned, and there is a lot to point out what Lierre Keith did wrong. You think what she mentions in her book is scientific facts?
Aaaand, here is a very well written article on this very subject:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jul/01/anti-soya-brigade-ignore-scaremongering
I myself try not to eat too much soy, there are other great options for getting protein. Hemp is fantastic, but hard to come buy. And then there’s buckwheat, seitan, quinoa…
Hi.
Nice site, but the “Independent Research” link is not working.
I like the site and the arguments sound convincing,…but then so did the ones FOR Soy Beans.
Some research with traceable proof would be a nice addition and one that I need before I move forward in making any health and nutritional changes to my kid’s diets.
Cheers
Brad
Thanks for the heads up. I fixed the link.
I honestly hadn’t heard any of this research.
Thanks for sending out word. I never thought soy would actually have such negative consequences. I really need to cut back my consumption now–don’t want my metabolism dropping or my protein absorption falling.
.-= Edmund Mokhtarian´s last blog post …Cannoli at Mike’s Pastry =-.
I don’t understand, I have been reading natural and organic sites to help me cope with menopause and they all tell me to eat soy. I take it this is a bad thing?
I would like you to go to an asian country and tell the that the fresh tofu that they have eaten everyday for centuries as well as the soymilk milled from the same beans are dangerous for their health. I would like to know your sources for the “non-traditional” state of fresh tofu and soymilk in asian cultures. Having an asian heritage and seeing myself the ancient soymilk mills made of stone in villages in China leaves me to question your factuality. “used only as condiments”… yes. Care not to be trapped in the western way of thinking. Asian public schools have been serving soy based products, fresh, for years. Edamame, anyone?
The sources are the ones cited in the article. One is an article by Nina Planck, the other is an article put out by the soy industry itself on the history of soymilk. As for “fresh” tofu, all you have to do is look up tofu on Wikipedia and you’ll learn about how it was made, kept, and served before the days of refrigeration. In other words, eating it “fresh” like we do now wasn’t really a widespread possibility until the advent of refrigeration. Sure, people still ate it fresh, but not in large quantities and only seasonally.
Hi, has anyone here heard of Dr Christiane Northrup? I have been very interested in her for a while now. She is a ob-gyn practising for the last 30 years and has published a few intense books on female health.
She states in her book Women’s Bodies, Women’s Wisdom that
”In 2009, an international group of nearly 20 researchers from around the world convened in Milan, Italy, for a meeting on isoflavones (phytoestrogens) and their implication in cancer, sponsored by the Council for Responsible Nutrition. Overall, the information presented in this conference strongly supported the idea that isoflavones are indeed safe for both women with breast cancer and for those who are at a high risk for developing breast cancer.” also, interestingly,
”Phyto-estrogens cannot act in the same way as oestradiol (the most biologically active of all estrogens) as oestradiol is a 3-dimensional molecule whereas phyto-estrogens tend to be planar. The geometry in space due to the chemical structure is very different. Another difference is that oestradiol contains a 6-angstrom biophore, found in many carcinogens. Phyto-estrogens contain a biphore, but not 6-angstroms, and is therefore not able to act as a carcinogen.”
This is the first scientific explanation I have heard discussing the biological link between estrogen and phyto-estrogens. What is your take on that?
Also, there was a comment made earier by someone who is suffering from thyroid problems due to soy intake, but I wanted to share what Dr. Northrup has to say on that topic too.
”Soy doesn’t disrupt thyroid funstion in those with normal thyroid function and adequate iodine. The relationship between soy and thyroid function has been studied for more than seventy years. Since then 14 human clinical trials have studied the effects of soy foods and soy isoflavones on thyroid function. All involved presumably healthy subjects, and with few exceptions, the soy product used was isolated soy protien. With only one exception, all of the studies showed either no effects or minor and clinically irrelevant effects of soy on thyroid function. The one trial that noted marked antithyroid effects (and the one that is often cited in anti-soy literature) involved Japanese adults who were fed roasted soybeans that had been pickled and stored in rice vinegar. It is not known what the soy protien or isoflavone content of this food was, and the study was not controlled.”
Aside from quoting someone else I just wanted to say, it seems obvious to me that the saying ”everything in moderation” fits well here. If you are buying pre packaged products that contain genetically modified processed soy ingredients, this is the first problem. If you are concerned about soy intake and eating this stuff, maybe someof your health problems also stem from the high fructose corn syrup, or for savory things, monosodium glutamate. The fact is that pretty much any food in excess can cause adverse effects. If you are consuming organic soy products fermented or not in moderation, it sounds like you will be fine.
I would also like to mention that the instance of soy allergy in children is about 1% and in adults 0.1%,multiply that by 6 if you are looking at milk or wheat allergies!
Well said.
thank you stephanie for some reason in all of this. We are complex carbohydrate eaters and plant eaters. Everything else should be in much moderation.
Dr. Mcdougall is a wonderful resource.
The China Study is a great book to own to inform yourself of nutritional issues (not about soy or tofu).
amy
Moderation, moderation, moderation! As Stephanie above noted. It is not a difficult concept to understand.
There is no (read NO) solid evidence that moderate consumption of tofu or other soy products has ill effects on human health. Soy is not a toxin. It is not a poison. It is an edible plant, that has been consumed in some form for millenia. That’s right: several thousand years.
It is true that Asians probably don’t eat as much soy as Westerners imagine, but as someone who lived in Asia (namely Japan) for years, a fair amount is consumed and two teaspoons a day seems low to me. Even if it is an accurate average: this means while some people eat none or little soy, others eat more. The question is: in those people who eat more, are there any demonstrably negative effects? There is no evidence of that.
Should we give up on all other foods and rampantly stuff soy down our gullets three meals a day? That seems like a no brainer as much exclusively eating any other single plant or animal source would be.
Yes, moderation is the key but none at all is better. Don’t eat soy daily and no more than a few teaspoons a week. Soy is an industrial product remember, used in plastics and ink. The stuff is not really a food and asians hardly eat the stuff because they know of it’s ill effects on the reproductive system. It’s mostly used to fix nitrogen in soil and the plant is thrown away. Also, since it is chock full of estrogen, it was used by the ancient chinese to reduce the libido of buddhist monks but the problem is that reduced testosterone causes many problems as well including depression (kind of explains why monks self immolated).
Soybeans are plants. Not man made. Sure, some soy products may be refined and used for other things, but the soybean is a natural growing plant.
Wow! I just read some of the comments and this is a very contentious subject isn’t it? I recently left a comment on someone’s blog (who I previously respected) because they were promoting a protein bar based on soy protein isolate crisps (how processed can you get?). It caused a huge wave of soy supporters to lash back at me, saying that I didn’t know what I was taking about and to employ the 90/10 rule – ie give yourself a break about consuming things you know might be bad for you.
I have done a good deal of research on soy and come to the same conclusions as you. I think we should all try to eat what we know is good for us 100% of the time. If you choose not to eat meat then there are plenty of other beans apart from soy that will not disrupt your hormones and deplete huge swathes of land through monoculture.
I believe we should try to eat what is native as much as possible and soy is not native for most of the world – definitely not british or americans.
I only ever eat a very small amount of miso or tamari as this seems to make sense – a very ancient and fermented form of soy, used in minute quantities.
x x x
Read people…READ!!! Again you are failing to do proper research to LEARN about food and your health…I suggest to all the book The China Study, the most comprehensive nutritional book ever undertaken. You want to know what makes women’s estrogen go whonky? MILK!!!!
Casein in milk has been known for over 100 years to hugely affect women’s estrogen levels. And THIS leads to super-charged estrogen production…NOT soy!!! Over-indulging in ANYTHING is wrong and is what’s wrong with most “affluent” societies.
Read and research people, one article can tell you nothing but what it is paid to tell you no matter who writes it.
I am a bit surprised to see how easily people reading this tend to accept it at face value and share it on Twitter or Facebook without reflecting on it or doing their own, proper research.
The only source for this (and similar) article is Lierre Keith’s book, that is not well researched to begin with – starting with the alleged ‘two teaspoons’ of ‘two tablespoons’ which is the first completely wrong turn, as she confuses intake of soy PRODUCTS per day with intake of soy PROTEIN per day. Regular tofu (100 g) contains 8.08 or 6.8 g of soy protein – so asians maybe consume two tablespoons of soy PROTEIN per day, but much more soy PRODUCTS. (That also conforms to the observations of people here on the forum like myself who have actually been to Asia for longer durations and shared typical meals with locals)
Second is that the ‘Weston A Price foundation’, which is both the only source of this article as also the only source of Lierre Keith’s book for ‘unbiased nutritional information’ is a well-known organization, to be precise, well-known for being a front of the meat and dairy industry. If you want to find out that meat and dairy are good for you, why we all should eat more of it, and that our Western diet is the best there is (notwithstanding the amount of obese and sick people you see on the streets and in hospitals if you care to look), then by all means, trust them to do your research for you.
If you would, on the other hand, rather read a scientific book from real scientists in nutrition, then start with reading the ‘China Study’ by Dr. Colin T. Campbell.
Best regards,
Andy
Andy,
You’ve misrepresented the Weston A. Price foundation. How could it be a front for the meat and dairy industry when the foundation recommends grass-fed beef as well as raw milk? That description is very far from the American beef industry’s method of operation (factory farming). Furthermore, the foundation does NOT believe that the western diet is good for you! With its high amount of refined carbohydrate, PUFA, and trans fatty acids, it is the opposite of what the foundation would recommend. Please re-read their website. Also, take your own advice and delve into criticisms of the China Study and Dr. Campbell’s hostile, unprofessional and unscientific reactions to all opposition.
Start here: http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
I grew up in a vegan household and ate soy extensively. My period came at age 9 and estrogen was rampant in my body. Even though my portions were measured and my calories were being counted, and I was extremely active and fit, I was overweight from when I was 15-27, and only when I cut out the soy and actually started consuming real, honest to goodness animal products and whole milk did I start losing weight. I lost 60 pounds last year and have 10-15 left to go.
And I have been eating soy since I was 11, got my period at 13, and have exceptionally low levels of estrogen (been tested several times). The point is every person reacts differently. If you listen to your body it will tell you what you should be eating. I can’t eat wheat, it makes me feel sick. I don’t do well with red meat either. I feel fine with soy, not with milk. Everything in moderation, do your research and listen to your body.
Hello,
I am wondering how good soybean oil is for you. After reading this article I have cut the soy out of my diet and am finding that soybean oil is in EVERYTHING. Do I need to steer clear from soybean oil as well?
Thanks!
~A
The moral of the story here is simply; for each human being to get to know their own body. There is no “well-meaning-blogger” or a “brilliant-scientist” (I like to think that I’m somewhere in between
) that can truly tell any specific individual how and what they should eat. We can only give generalized “opinions” whether or not they are based on our First Hand Experiences (which is always biased), Scientific Facts (which is based on conclusive & non-conclusive data, and/or Accumulated Knowledge (which always will be limited based on the aforementioned “scientific facts”).
I like to believe that the author of this article provided a bullet-proof report as best she could and TRIED to give an unbiased view (which is almost impossible unless she had only stated 100% scientific facts, not including words like “Thankfully, more and more independent research has been done regarding the dangers of soy, and what it’s revealed should scare you.” which was her opening statement). But realistically she was biased and perhaps well meaning but information shouldn’t “scare you” it should empower you to make better life decisions.
That aside all who say “soy in moderation” as a general guideline are pretty accurate but it tends to be on the safe side, which is fine. Eating soy exclusively like @Revenwyn does/did or as a meat-replacement like @Scott does/did is also not in anybody’s best health interest and all the research I’ve read points to that direct. Now should it be avoided? Well that’s a different story and a personal choice. I on the other hand stick to fermented soy and consume soy in very moderate amounts. I like my food plant-based and raw anyways so soy is probably one of the last options to choose especially before meat.
The point I’m trying to make is that be aware, be conscious, and be open minded. You can be wrong, you can be right it’s fine just learn as much as you can from different intelligent sources, get to know yourself more and how you digest foods, and listen to your “gut” instincts. There is no one-size fit all (excuse me for sounding a bit cliche)… I can go on but I don’t want to make my comment any longer than it needs to be. Ultimately take responsibility of your own health and stay positive!
Cheers,
Sir Adam
This is a good article about soy. However, the statements, “Phytates are enzyme-inhibitors that block mineral absorption in human digestive tract. They are naturally present in all grains, seeds, nuts, and legumes (which is why everyone should read this primer on how to eat grains, if you eat them at all.)” …….. this sounds to me to be extreme. Again, and especially, the words, “…present in ALL grains, seeds, nuts, and legumes….” and, “…..IF YOU EAT THEM AT ALL.” ……sounds like you are wanting to persuade people to NOT eat ANY grains, seeds, nuts, and legumes. I’m surprised no one else picked up on this. Please clarify this. Thanks.
What about Almond Milk? Good or bad? I just bought Silk brand Almond Milk as HIGHLY recommended by the registered Dietitian at the grocery store. (He also suggested soy ‘everything.’) Ingredients as listed on the container reads:
All natural Almondmilk (filtered water, almonds), Calcium, Carbonate, Sea Salt, Natural Flavor, Locust, Bean Gum, Gellan Gum, Sunflower Lecithin, d-alpha-Tocopherol (natural vitamin E), Zinc Gluconate, Vitamin A Palmitate, Riboflavin (B2), Vitamin B12, Vitamin D2. Allergen Statement: Contains Almond. May contain Coconut. Made in USA. Made from Almonds that were not genetically engineered.
after my digestive tract became significantly damaged by soy i also developed a HUGE sensitivity to “gellan” aka carrageenan aka red seaweed/ seaweed extract/ agar/ etc… it goes by many names and is subject for another long discussion.
i would encourage you to begin researching the controversy surrounding this other presumed “natural” additive so you will be able to discern truth from hype
as well- LISTEN TO WHAT YOUR BODY TELLS YOU (sure wish i had learned to sooner!), *it* knows what it is reacting to and is trying to tell *you*
I almost forgot to ask…..has anyone ever just followed what is listed in the Bible as what we should and should not eat? The original “Owner’s Manual?”
That is what we do! I don’t aree with the belief that we weren’t allowed to eat meat until after the flood. Abel’s offering supports my belief, since he offered only the ‘choice’ parts of the animal and some fat. The rest? Eaten! The rules were explained further in what to do with offerings at the Temple or Tent of Meeting. Why didn’t Noah eat meat? How many animals were packed on the ark? How long were they at sea?
Nice article about Soy – it should be noted that most non-organic soy is genetically modified as well just to add to the reasons not consume too much soy. Like everything in diet (and life) balance is the key; not too much of anything and a wide variety of everything is the best way. We are omnivores after all.
Living in Indonesia and spending my whole life with a serving of tempe cooked in various ways on the dinner menu, I’ve never really had a problem with soy, or any health-related problems from anything I eat, except for that really bad stomach pain I get after eating McDonald’s–then again, this is probably the first time I read about soy formula and soy burgers and all sorts of genetically modified things that to be honest rather freaks me out.
Thank you for such a well-rounded article! I recently discovered that it’s mainly soy that has been causing my migraines for the past decade. And as I’m doing more research into I wonder, “WHY are soy products even allowed to be sold?!” They are destroying our country’s health all the while most Americans are still convinced that they’re a health food.
Checking the fda website as listed in the weston price pdf – more hits are retrieved by typing in “corn” (342 references)than results from “soy” (196). Close behind are such plants as: onions (188), wheat (181), oats (138) and carrots (116). Guess we should avoid those too?
I value Dr. Weil’s expertise in this area.
My son is allergic to milk and my Naturopathic doctor,(read highly educated on alternative lifestyles and choices) recommended Soy milk. When i asked him about the soy=bad concept he informed me this was a NOT the case and thats its very much a falsehood. He said through his (again highly educated) research and schooling that soy does not create estrogen in the body it blances the estrogen (for women) or testerone (for men). My doctor also said of course anything is bad for you in HUGE doses. Noone should use soy as their only protein source.
Also can just to mention to a earlier post ‘the bible’ is not even close to being everyone’s owners manual.
An eye opening moment occured for me as I am in health care & began working with oncologist within our region. Every Oncologist I called on said they immediately take all cancer patients off any source of soy product upon diagnosis of cancer. Each had a different way of saying it stimulated the devlopment of new cancer cells. Also our pediatrician asked that I not give any soy containing product to our son’s from birth as it suppresses testosterone production in males & decreases brain development.
Take a minute to look at this study on soy and its affects on pre-menopausal vs. post-menopausal women.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2278276/pdf/canfamphys00052-0109.pdf
It’s a very different story if you’re 20 vs. 60. It’s all about having a balanced diet. Legumes are an excellent source of protein, among other vitamins and minerals and have been consumed by humans for thousands of years. The key is to be balanced. If soy is your only protein source, you will have proteins, just like you would if beef was your only protein source, or apples were the only fruit you ate.
Correction* If soy is your only protein source, you will have problems*
There are many misconceptions here. How can anyone think a simple bean can give men boobs or lower sperm count? Regarding the early onset of puberty, especially in girls, I might blame all the hormones in milk and cheese these days before a bean.
This may be a dumb question (if there is such a thing), but regarding questions about milk alternatives for infants: What about mother’s milk? Is breast feeding not an alternative? Wet nurses used to be common and available to families needing help with this issue. Does anyone know if mother’s milk “banks” exist? We can buy human sperm and eggs, why not mother’s milk?
Yes they exist, but the mother’s milk they sell is EXPENSIVE and often even pasteurized (weird, I know).
So maybe humans didn’t evolve as vegetarians. But while we were evolving to be/stay omnivores, we also had relatively small population sizes. We didn’t take over the whole planet, and we didn’t get in the way of other species survival (at least, far less than we do now). So we could afford to consume meat. In the modern era, however, we are far exceeding our fair share of resources. Typical Western diets, which include tons of meat, are partially to blame: meat production (whether industrially farmed, pasture-fed, whatever) necessarily uses more energy. Why? It’s about food chains. Each level of a food chain has less energy & organic matter at its disposal than the one below it. That is, plants have the most energy available to them (from sunlight). The first level of consumers (called primary consumers) has access to roughly 10% of plants’ energy. Secondary consumers, the next level up, can access about 10% of that – 1% of plants’ energy. Tertiary (third level) consumers can access about .1% of plants’ energy, and so on and so forth. Therefore, it takes much more energy to support equal populations of secondary consumers than primary consumers. So from an ecological, big-picture perspective, soy, as something that enables humans to be primary consumers and therefore use less energy, is really not that bad after all. What do you think?
It’s so sad. I can’t convince my parents to change their food habits, because they’ve been programmed by their religion that they’re eating the ‘right’ way. Yet my mother suffers from debilitating migraines, is having problems with arrhythmia, and has gone through testing for food allergies; my father has had major dental work done. Why? their diet focuses heavily on soy milk, tofu, TVP, and anything not meat, since the ‘religion’ they’re in claims that meat is evil. Yet before they became involved to the extent they are now, we rarely got sick. Why? We ate traditional foods! I hope they wake up befroe their healthy eating kills them!
I would add that soy is hidden in so many of the foods we eat every day and we don’t even realize it. For instance, eggs have soy because it is fed to the chickens. I was buying organic salmon for the longest time, thinking that it was cleaner and it was on the advice of my nutritionist. One day, the store where I was buying the fish had an information sheet about the organic salmon and it said that it is farmed and fed soy! Again, I was unknowingly consuming soy and feeding it to my kids…Very upsetting…
Soy is the largest genetically modified (GMO) crop in the US, engineered by Monsanto, a chemical company. Why? Because they do this to enhance sales of their huge Billion dollar money machine — Roundup weed pesticide which is almost <emhalf of their corporate revenue.
In the early days of the GMO evolutionary timeline (GMO soy seeds were first available in 1996), non-GMO soy crops were found to be harmed by Roundup, so the engineering program was devised as a way to enhance sales of the chemical to farmers by making the crop resistant to the harmful effects.
The decision to develop GMO seeds was clearly profit-motivated and has not been without consequences, some of which include: scientific proof of birth defects in farm animals, weed-resistant strains that now are threatening to get totally out of control and small farmers losing their farms through aggressive "seed-royalty" lawsuits by Monsanto due to unknown crop cross-contaminatations from nearby GMO-planted farms.
Latest
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/11/17/sex-and-soybean-health-caution.aspx?e_cid=20111117_DNL_art_3
Curious what the effects of soy formula are for baby boys.
I just believe the dosage makes the poison. I eat tofu, tempeh and use soy protein powder. While I don’t eat soy products everyday I do use them as a vegetarian and I’ve been just fine. Although I do not advocate heavy doses of soy in a balanced diet I do say it has benefits and the choice to do with it or not is a matter of choice. I will say it is alarming how many foods use soy products hence why I read labels and I only do raw organic foods. I don’t do dairy and I eat very little whole grain or wheat based carbs and some soy. I’m big on fruits, veggies and occasionally fish. Soy has defects but it also has benefits and should not be relied on heavily for nutrients especially proteins.
I am asian and i eat soy every day.. is it two teaspoon full per day.. NO, more like palm size… is it sidedish? NO, more like main dish… We don’t eat much meat (although with western influence we are increasing our meat intake now), and so to add protein in our diet we normally eat soy products like soybean milk, soft or hard tofu, tempeh, fermented beans like miso etc… I believe it improves our health.. I have no idea about thyroid, it is not common in my family or friends I know.. So is it really soy to blame? I believe you should do more research than this… I believe soy to be highly nutritious. And NO I am not vegetarian..
How funny I was just about to post the same point too, and saw your post, I am Asian also and was shock to see the average amount of soy intake is only 2 teaspoon! Fresh soymilk is my favorite for breakfast in the morning before I moved to US! And yesterday I just cooked a big plate of spicy tofu as main dish! I probably ate about a whole cup of it, and have some more left over the next day for lunch, soy sauce might be 2 teaspoons a day…lol and so far I am still lean and healthy~( knock on the wood…) There are so many studies aginst this food or that food, in my culture we believe in “Middle way”, so I guess I will not eliminate all soy product, but will try to eat more natural food and be balanced with all kinds of food~
i have read it stated by various sources that Asians tend to have certain digestive enzymes in high levels that are either lacking or very low in those of Anglo/Euro/Meditteranean descent… and that these enzymes are thought to be precisely the reason that Asians seem to do well with soy whereas so many others find they do not.
also, the type of soy products used may make a huge difference too- and there is absolutely NOTHING remotely natural about the heavily processed “soy protein isolates”. i wonder if your diet was filled with these to the extent mine was, whether you would find your good health tanking in the same way mine did?
But please! DONT test that theory to find out!!
I definitely won’t be basing my decisions about soy on an article written by someone without any medical or scientific credentials of any type. I have been eating soy for 30 years, no problems, no breast cancer, no heart problems (even had a heart cath and my arteries were totally unblocked prior to an elective surgery). My husband has been eating soy products and a vegetarian diet since he was 14 and also has no problems.
Sigh, I remember when eggs were “dangerous” too.. now they aren’t..who to believe?
but… you can at least admit it is possible that not everyone will respond to soy in te positive way you feel that you and yr hubby have?
the dern stuff nearly killed me, for example (ive posted some comments up higher in this list giving details for anyone curious to know more about how)
I have noticed that soy lecithin is in many foods, snacks etc. I am not supposed to have soy, but I am finding it hard to avoid. I find it amusing that a food is labeled organic yet contains soy lecitan or was processed on the same machinery as soy. Please tell me is soy lecithin safe if not how do I avoid it. what can we the people do to save our food and protect ourselves.
I was recently diagnosed with a soy and wheat intolerance. It’s been an eye opening experience to see how many items have soy in them. Gluten free items, vitamins, cough drops, and most gel tablets to name a few.
I am still researching soy but as far as “asians only eat fermented” I have lived in China for 15 years and hot soymilk is a regular breakfast drink AND people eat tons of soybeans with their meals….not sure where they got that info from.